Greetings and welcome to The Quest for Wisdom Podcast, where we search for nuggets of wisdom from the lives of some truly amazing people.
Today’s guest is Jona – a human rights activist, influencer and frontline worker who has spent years in women’s shelters and refugee shelters, now helping women exit prostitution and challenging mainstream narratives around “sex work”. In this wide-ranging and emotional conversation, Conor and Jona explore:
- Why Jona believes prostitution is exploitation, not empowerment, and how legalisation in Germany has fuelled human trafficking
- The hidden realities of women in brothels, Stockholm syndrome, and how Johns talk about women in online forums
- What it really means to flee war and become a refugee, and why Europe’s asylum systems are often a “beautiful prison”
- How extremism, radicalisation and cancel culture grow in the gaps between fear, identity and belonging
- Homelessness, addiction, “dopamine culture”, and why giving people cash and a path might work better than punishment
- ADHD, overstimulation and the search for silence in the modern world – and why Jona wants to cope without relying on medication
- The lifelong struggle to “find yourself”, let go of control, and accept that who you are is enough
If you’ve ever wondered how to hold compassion for people in prostitution, refugees, addicts, or even your younger self, this conversation will give you a lot to sit with.
“You are who you are, and that is more than enough” – Jona
Key topics discussed
- Prostitution, “sex work”, and radical feminism
- Why Jona rejects the slogan “sex work is work” and sees prostitution as structural exploitation, especially of poor and migrant women.
- How umbrella terms like “sex work” allow privileged OnlyFans creators to speak over women in street and brothel prostitution.
- The impact of legalisation in Germany, the spike in human trafficking, and why Jona favours the Nordic model that targets Johns rather than prostituted women.
- Human trafficking and the illusion of choice
- Stories from Jona’s time in women’s shelters, including trafficked minors from Eastern Europe and the slow grooming process behind “choice”.
- How stereotypes about “happy prostitutes” mask addiction, coercion, debt bondage and psychological manipulation.
- The role of drugs, Stockholm syndrome and violence in keeping women trapped.
- Refugees, war and Western responsibility
- Jona and Conor reflect on fleeing war, the Balkan conflicts, and friends who walked for years from Syria to Germany.
- Why asylum systems often mean years of waiting, near-zero income, no right to work, and living in poor conditions while being publicly vilified.
- How Western arms sales, bombing campaigns and geopolitical games fuel the very crises that produce refugees.
- Extremism, ISIS, and radicalisation
- How young women from Europe became radicalised and travelled to join ISIS, often out of identity crisis, rebellion and a longing to belong.
- The Shamima Begum case, citizenship stripping, and the ethical dilemma of permanently exiling teenagers who made catastrophic choices.
- Why extreme ideologies on any side feed off alienation, humiliation and simplistic “good vs evil” stories.
- Left, right and the politics of division
- Why people in economic distress are easily persuaded to blame migrants instead of failed social and economic policy.
- How media and political parties weaponise refugee narratives while ignoring housing, wages and cost of living.
- Discussion of extreme left vs extreme right, cancel culture, censorship and the “political horseshoe” where extremes start to resemble each other in behaviour.
- Homelessness, addiction and “dopamine economics”
- Why Conor compares some forms of sex work to drug dealing – both monetise human vulnerability and compulsion.
- How addiction and homelessness are often rooted in trauma rather than “bad choices”.
- Ideas for practical interventions: giving people cash plus structure, QR-based donations for the cashless age, and staged housing with integrated work opportunities.
- The darknet, Telegram and violence online
- A tour through the darknet: assassins-for-hire marketplaces, torture “red rooms”, and human experiments – and what this reveals about demand.
- Telegram mega-groups sharing detailed advice on drugging and raping women, and what this says about misogyny at scale.
- Questions around surveillance, encryption, “free” platforms and who actually pays for them.
- ADHD, overstimulation and the search for silence
- Jona’s ADHD diagnosis, brief use of medication, and decision to seek non-pharmacological ways of coping.
- How modern life – constant stimulation, social media, sugar, processed foods – makes “abnormal” responses feel like normal reactions to an inhuman environment.
- Conor’s experiment with radical sobriety (no alcohol, drugs, caffeine, sugar, gluten, animal products) and the long, painful road to experiencing inner silence.
- Identity, calling and the pressure to have it figured out
- Jona’s tension between activism, conventional work, and the desire to speak, teach and create change.
- The anxiety of wanting everything planned vs the reality that life rarely follows a neat script.
- The idea that labels like ADHD or autism can be useful maps to your strengths and limits, rather than cages.
Timestamps
- Guest Intro: Jona – Activist, Feminist, Refugee Child
[00:00:00 – 00:06:30]
Conor introduces Jona and her work with women in prostitution, women’s shelters and refugee shelters; they share how long they’ve been planning this in-person conversation. - “Sex Work Is Work”? – Why Jona Disagrees
[00:06:31 – 00:22:30]
Jona explains her radical feminist critique of mainstream feminism, umbrella terms like “sex work”, and why she sees prostitution and much of porn as exploitation rather than empowerment. - Legal Prostitution and Human Trafficking in Germany
[00:22:31 – 00:34:00]
They discuss Germany’s legal prostitution regime, the estimated percentage of women not there voluntarily, human trafficking from Eastern Europe, and Jona’s support for the Nordic model that fines Johns, not women. - Inside Women’s Shelters: Violence, Escape and Starting Again
[00:34:01 – 00:46:00]
Jona shares stories from her years in women’s shelters: domestic abuse, police referrals, restraining orders, children, and the slow process of rebuilding a life after violence. - Refugee Realities: From War Zones to “Cold, Wet” Europe
[00:46:01 – 01:00:00]
Conor and Jona talk about fleeing war, long journeys on foot, trauma, and the reality of life in European asylum systems where people wait years, cannot work, and live in poor conditions under hostile public opinion. - Extremism, ISIS and Young Women’s Radicalisation
[01:00:01 – 01:15:30]
They explore why some young women join ISIS, identity and rebellion, the Shamima Begum case, and how citizenship stripping creates “stateless” people stuck in camps. - Left vs Right, Media Fear and the Migrant Scapegoat
[01:15:31 – 01:30:00]
A deep dive into German and UK politics, refugees as political tools, rising far-right parties, and why economic pain often gets redirected onto migrants instead of systems. - Darknet, Telegram and the Violence We Don’t Want to See
[01:30:01 – 01:44:00]
Conor describes exploring the darknet: assassins, torture streams, “human experiments”, while Jona talks about huge Telegram groups sharing tips on drugging and raping women. - Homelessness, Addiction and Utopian Experiments
[01:44:01 – 01:59:00]
They compare sex work and drug dealing, discuss experiments giving cash to addicts and the idea of “new beginning” backpacks and staged housing plus job pathways for homeless people. - ADHD, Overthinking and the Quest for Silence
[01:59:01 – 02:12:00]
Jona shares her ADHD diagnosis, brief medication use and desire to cope without pills; Conor talks about cold plunges, sobriety, meditation and finally experiencing quiet in his own head. - Finding Your Calling and Letting Go of Control
[02:12:01 – 02:22:00]
They explore what it means to “find yourself” in your 20s, detach from outcomes, trust your calling and accept that you don’t have to have it all figured out. - Four Words of Wisdom: “I Am Who I Am”
[02:22:01 – end]
Jona closes with her words of wisdom: “I am who I am, and that’s more than enough”, and they reflect on radical self-acceptance as the foundation for change.
Thank You!
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